Original art by Mark Valentine
Americans do not approve of torture…
That said, most of us are conflicted about “The Torture Report.”
There are some big problems with it. First of all, it didn’t stop any of the torture. The techniques were abandoned years ago. Second, the release of the report made Americans and our allies less safe by opening old wounds and offering propaganda opportunities for our enemies.
On the surface, it appeared to be California senator Dianne Feinstein inflicting a wound on the CIA to get even with them for looking at her emails. Aside from the decision to put us at risk for such a personal reason, the report made the mistake of passing judgment out of context.
We had watched in horror as the enemy took down the World Trade Center and tried to take out the Pentagon. We were stunned that the innocents on the planes had no human value to the terrorists. And they’d said another wave was coming. But, for those of you who support this report, let’s be totally fair and judge other historical actions out of context.
It was wrong for Harry Truman to drop an atomic bomb on Hiroshima. Then after seeing the destruction, he repeated the atrocity again on Nagasaki. Maybe Dianne Feinstein should have called for Truman to be tried as a war criminal.
In 1962, President John F. Kennedy ordered the use of Agent Orange on Vietnamese civilian populations. Should Dianne Feinstein issue a report on that before she leaves the committee?
In 1998, President Clinton destroyed a pharmaceutical plant in Sudan with cruise missiles. His original assumption that the plant was being used to create chemical weapons turned out to be completely false. Imagine a foreign country launching an attack on a US business. Will Dianne Feinstein be issuing a report on that?
Even personal decisions can’t be fairly judged without the context of the moment.
Entire websites are based on haircuts that seemed like a good idea at the time. One of the fastest growing businesses in the United States is tattoo removal.
In today’s context, they cancelled the national release of a major motion picture because of a threat somebody posted on the Internet.
Sony thinks that’s a wise decision.
Guess we’ll have to wait several years for a report from Congress to see if it really was.
Until then we, won’t know if that was the correct response or not.
I’ll stand with John McCain. And people forget that Sen. Feinstein is one of the CIA’s biggest supporters in Congress.
That Obama and the Republicans didn’t want it released is good enough reason for it’s release. But since this is just 666-pgs of the Senate summary and fewer citizens have read it than the folks in Congress who read ANY bill have read of anything crossing their desk, the outrage will be deflected with a Greek chorus of pure politics.
We paid two psychologists of dubious credibility over $80-million to grade their own work. Who vetted these bozos? Where is any proof that these techniques provided any information which stopped anything?
Does anyone with a pulse have any confidence in an endorsement by Dick Cheney?
It is always better to ask forgiveness rather than seek permission. War is hell and things happen in the fog of war.
Opening up the can of worms which is torturing prisoners brings up the Carlin rule. If you wish to make a horrible thing less horrible, use more syllables to soften it. Torture vs enhanced interrogation techniques. Why it becomes relatively quaint.
Leaders opened the door for the crimes committed. Leaders should suffer the consequences of their actions. Stand up and face the music.
When the Marines launched their first attacks in the Pacific in WWII, they saw the horror of what happened to their brothers who died. Within a few weeks some Marines began to cut off ears, take the gold teeth of the Japanese soldiers.
A Sgt. stopped his men, telling them that the grief of what happened to American soldiers was awful. That he understood the anger and grief which led them to mutilate the dead.
You might not think about this tomorrow or the next day. But someday it will come back and haunt you for the rest of your life. I can’t let you do this to yourself. I could not live with myself if I don’t stop these acts.
This is the America I know. Where good can triumph over evil because we are better than that.
While this comment remains under moderation, I will remind myself of what Thomas Jefferson once said.
It is better for a thousand criminals to go free than for one man to be unjustly convicted.
Amen Orphan. Anyone against the release of these documents is against transparency and democracy.
One of the better the better comments I have read on a local Kansas City blog site. John McCain, a POW himself, a man that gave blood for American ideals, is one of the few Americans that has the authority to speak on matters like this. And we should listen to him. I am not calling for the arrest of George W Bush or Cheney, or anyone else for that matter, but we should reflect on who America really is.
The democrat’s report also does not say anything about how our current President plays weekly with a special deck of cards to select who will be killed with drones. Several innocent and guilty American citizens have been killed this way along with many innocent men, women, and children who just happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time ensuring hatred of America for a generation at least.
The news articles and the opinion piece (link attached) tell how Obama is personally involved in drone targets.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/31/opinion/too-much-power-for-a-president.html?_r=0
Isn’t it time that Obama returned his Nobel Peace Prize along with the money?
Maybe after seven-plus hours of moderation you’ll see I agree on the drones.
Perhaps even more horrific than the torture as many more innocents were killed.
And then there are those we sent to other countries rather than interrogate them ourselves.
Jordon got results, Syria tortured and we knew it well and Egypt, well they all just disappeared there.
When the President and the both political parties want to ignore something, it means they want to cover up their misdeeds.
Rand Paul and Bernie Sanders in ought-16!
“Second, the release of the report made Americans and our allies less safe by opening old wounds and offering propaganda opportunities for our enemies.”
How exactly does this release make us less safe? Please explain this in detail to me because I do not follow your thought processes on this.
If you can’t defend the action, then attack the messenger. Nice tact.
War is hell. Good on the CIA. Why should anyone feel an ounce of sympathy for those who align themselves with terrorism. America better than that is the credo of those who Monday morning quarterback. If it saved but one life is fine logic for taking the 2nd Amendment but requires a 666 page trumped up report for Democrats to generate a media circus of sympathizers.
Testing
Six people here, seven if you include the petulant and vicious Feinstein creature, who would not have waterboarded a terrorist even if it could have prevented the murder of 100 Pakistani school children this week. Or several thousand of their fellow countrymen. So easy to stand self-righteously on principle when you are not responsible for the lives of others.
Lydia,
I disagree with you. 3200 Americans died in terrorist attacks from 1970-2007. God rest all of their souls, but are 3200 people worth selling our American values for? I tend to think the 407,000 American soldiers that gave their life in WWII to protect American freedoms would think otherwise. You have to keep things in perspective. 3200 people is a tragedy, but the terrorists win, and its a smack in the face to those who fight to protect freedom and American exceptionalism if we give it away so easily.
Since when is it an American value to cower in wait of the next attack instead of doing what needs to be done to protect innocent people? I am thankful that people like you are not responsible for defending this country, and hope you realize that given your craven soap box posturing, you have made it clear you would be one of the first to submit to whatever tyranny comes along if given the chance. You would have averted your eyes, stood on your “principles” and allowed those children to be killed in Pakistan. I have nothing but contempt for those who don’t have the courage to face reality and who don’t respect those who do.
It is you dear that is cowering. So fearful of an attack that you would give away all America has stood for, and so many before us have fought for. Reality? The reality is that terrorism is not as big of a threat as you wish to believe. What did those before us, and among us give their lives for in Americas many wars? If not for freedom and America, then what? America is the shining city on hill. What we are not is North Korea, Al-qaeda, or the Taliban.
Your attempt to make me complacent in the murder of over 100 children is despicable. But not even 1000 children, in a world of 6 billion, are worth trading freedom and American exceptionalism for. If the terrorists want to terrorize me, it will have to be over my cold body.
Unfortunately, it appears the terrorists have already terrorized you, and so easily. If Hitler had known he would only have to kill 100 children to change the world, alot of lives would have been saved, and we could have the pleasure of speaking German today.
+1
Why was my comment deleted? It contained no profanity, and no insensitive remarks. If mine was deleted, Lydia’s should be deleted for accusing me of being complicit in the murder of over a 100 children! You posted my comment and now you delete it. This is a private blog site, and if you wish to censor, by all means it is your right. But if the censoring of IDEAS is the future of KC Confidential, then I will not return. I absolutely LOVED this blog, I have never posted ONE four letter word, never used ANY racist language. Admin please respond on this public forum, not sending me an email. I also kindly ask that you repost my reply.
I apologize, the comment is now back up.
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety
Testing again
Like a lot of people after 9-11… I wanted swift action and I will admit…some revenge. But there was not swift action… It came months later and the fight against the Taliban was coupled with a larger invasion of Iraq… which felt unrelated to the 9-11 perps…. So now…. 14 years later… The Taliban is mowing down kids by the hundreds and Iraq is a mess… The Middle East is not better off than it was 14 years ago and we multiplied our number of enemy states. So I am not interested in Cheney defending torture… It is also quite clear now more than ever that Cheney was indeed running the show… A lot of people profited immensely from these wars. But many lives were lost and the situation is only worse. Rand Paul has a huge advantage in this next election.
Now?