The Supreme Court upheld The affordable Care Act yesterday, Obama‘s health care reform…
This was considered the President’s big achievement, and it passed five votes to four in a nail biter. But just like in sports, a win is a win.
The question being, did We the People win?
For many the answer is NO.
Basically it’s just another tax on individuals. A more fair thing would be for the GOVERNMENT to foot the bill, but no such luck, they passed it on to all of us.
The concept though is a good one.
All Americans should receive health care, but many don’t. So in theory it’s the right thing to do. Obama’s health care law doesn’t go into effect until 2014, at which time an individual who isn’t insured will be fined a small amount of money that’s slated to climb each year for several years
And companies with more than 50 and less than 199 employees will be required to provide health care, creating the fear that some small businesses may not increase the number of employees they hire to avoid taking the hit. Businesses now are not required to provide insurance to emplyees unless they have 200 or more full-time workers. Businesses with less than 50 will remain exempt under the new law.
Republican candidate Mitt Romney is all over the issue, against it, of course.
The bad thing about Romney though is that at this point he just doesn’t have much of a platform.
He’s mostly just saying Obama sucks.
On top of that, Romney’s just not very exciting and his wealth – he was born into the big money – is a killer. People say Mitt has no feel or feelings for the little guy. He says he cares, but it’s a tough sell. The man’s worth several hundred million and climbing. Not exactly what you’d call a man of the people.
And there just isn’t any evidence to consider Mitt our new savior.
So Obama Care is a go.
The stock market’s strong and the economy’s weak, but hanging in there.
Which looks to me like it’s President Barack Obama for the next four years, folks.
right on glaze…
and more importantly…the free loaders who can afford insurance…and who don’t
buy it…now will have to pony up and pay for their health care.
When those free loaders go to the emergency room (lots of them) and they ring up
a big bill…they’ll have to have insurance.
Obama/Biden 2012.
Obama did a terrible job selling the new aca. He’s got a second chance to explain
the benefits of the program. Quarter billion dollars was spent to drag down the
bill the first time….now he can sell it because it can almost never be repealed.
Social Studies 101
Glazer says ” A more fair thing would be for the GOVERNMENT to foot the bill, but no such luck, they passed it on to all of us.” Glazer — The only money the government has comes from us — whether they get it in the form of taxes, debt, or fines.
i think the tax
is only on people who don’t buy the insurance….its a tax or a penalty….its confusing..but
people who can afford it now have to buy it….but the law has some loopholes there too..
sometimes you have to get the best you can in legislation.
willard is up the creek
WASHINGTON — One of the few individuals who worked on health care reform under both Mitt Romney and President Barack Obama said on Friday that the controversial individual mandate provision was virtually identical in the bills signed into law by each of them.
He’ll have a tough time when he lies about obamas program. the program willard romney put in
massachussettes is almost identical to the one obama did….really!
debate:
romney: the obamacare program is wrong
obama: but mitt…its the same program you claimed was so incredible
in massachusettes and which now is insuring 98% of people in that state..
you were the godfather of this health care program!!!!
lance…got the information from huffington post….its an ap article.
The Conservative’s Conservative in the Federal judiciary sez
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/the_breakfast_table/features/2012/_supreme_court_year_in_review/john_roberts_reached_the_correct_decision_but_obamacare_is_still_a_very_bad_law_.html
Since the ruling basically gutted the Commerce Clause for the future, Obama won the battle but lost the war.
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_examiner/2012/06/obamacare_and_medicaid_how_the_supreme_court_s_ruling_will_make_it_harder_to_extend_health_insurance_to_the_poor_.html
I guess the “loyal opposition” is upset too many crumbs fell off of the insurance industry’s plate onto the peasants. ‘Cause otherwise the Liberals got their ass kicked with the win.
Funny so many people hate the ACA when asked but then proceed to say they like the individual parts of the program.
Pink houses for you and me…
Fluff
I think Gl;azer is the resident KCC fluffer.
When life gives you lemons make lemon drop martinis
Romney raised another $2.5 million yesterday. Glenn Beck has already taken orders for close to one million t-shirts with a picture of John Roberts and the word COWARD……at $32.00 a piece. The right wing evangelical Christians who vowed to stay home in November because they think Romney is a Mormon devil are rethinking their position. Numerous credible CEO’s and economists said the decision basically cemented the chilling effect on new job creation and business infrastructure investment.
All this decision did is move us one step closer to getting where we need to go, a full blown shoot to kill revolution. I even bought another 1000 rounds of 9mm today at cheaperthandirt.com. It was angry white men that founded this country and it’s gonna be angry whie men that take it back. Our Judeo Christian values and disciplined capitalistic work ethic are being usurped for nanny state welfare multiculturalism. Even some of the more moderate commie libs are getting sick and tired of it.
Let’s get to it! I’m sighted in at 100, 500 and 1000 yards and CQC is like foreplay to me. Live Free or Die!
Smartman, do you find it remotely interesting
to go back and review the famous George Snufulufugus / Obama interview where George was trying to pin Obama to admitting it was a tax, while the President denied 3 times, before the cock crowed, that it was in no way a tax. Then move to yesterday where the SC stated they weren’t responsibile for the boneheads we elect, but did have the power to pass this as a tax. A tax? Interesting. I didn’t think it was a tax. My President said it wasn’t a tax, didn’t he?
So the basic comment of the SC was, this isn’t constitutional, Roberts said he felt he had to make it pass, they had no way around it being constitutional, so, they call it a tax because they can rule on that.
We live in interesting times. Your ammo purchase, while surely to be shot full of holes by others on here, is a far more logical move than the the one made by the SC yesterday.
And the salutation, may you live in interesting times?
On the other hand….
Several legal scholars have stated that the SC decision is quite a coup for conservatives because it concedes the battle on this particular law (which can be refought in the congress at any time) while gaining massive ground in the war against unlimited congressional authority via the commerce clause.
I think that’s why a number of liberals who concurred with the SC were also hopping mad about the reasoning behind the decision being enshrined as the majority opinion.
YMMV….
@cindy loo hoo
What was more interesting was the response Jay Carney provided today when asked about the “tax”. I’m paraphrasing, but he said just because SCOTUS “said” it was a tax doesn’t make it a tax. So now we’re back to Bill Clinton saying ” it depends on what the definition of is…is. Apparently words mean different things in each branch of government.
A friend of mine teaches constitutional law at Penn State. In terms of sheer stupidity he put yesterday’s decision in a unique perspective. He said it was the equivalent of Billy Payne and the board of directors at Augusta National Golf Club inviting Sistah Souljah to become a member.
The language of politicians, barristers and jurists alike is becoming too vague and cute for my liking. The Constitution was never intended to be fitted with 5X stretch pants from WalMart.
I have sent a 12 pack of Charmin bathroom tissue to the justices at the SC with a note respectfully imploring them that the next time they need to wipe their asses to use the toilet paper and not the Constitution.. I suspect a knock on my door one day next week.
batten down the hatches…
the repubs just can’t take it. Their leader (willard) gets a program of health care passed in the
commonwealth which insure 98% of the residents. Mass. takes less money than they get
from the feds and its working. Why not apply this law nationally.
It’s over gang. Thanks you justice roberts. He saw the polls. he saw the movement.
I listened the nite before to the oral arguments on cspan and it seemed that the
conservative justcies were really jumping on the guy from the IFOB and that attorney
from the 25 states. I think other people saw it differently but it seemed that alito and
roberts both were somewhat going after the 2 attorneys for the states and businesses.
I think that as people see this program go into effect they will like it.
No legisltation is perfect. something had to be done. If you currently have
insurance you will be able to stay with that program.
I’m sick and tired of the lack of personal responsibility by americans.
Lets clamp down on those who are at the public trough…whether they are
welfare cheats….medicare fraudsters….subsidies to billion dollar profit
companies…people not paying their taxs (I saw that from 2006 the government
is owed over 300 billion dllars…lets crack down on the offshore rip offs…
the companies who avoid taxes…there’s so much to go after and essentially
we can pay for anything we want including free health insurance for
everyone in the nation….how does this waste and throwing away
money go on….
Karen Carpenter Says
We’ve only just begun Harley. The decision yesterday was the political equivalent of the japs bombing Pearl Harbor. The sleeping right wing giant has been awakened. Nukes to come in November. Keep running your mouth and masturbating to your Obama calendar and let the rest of us deal with the critical thinking. I went to Mi Ranchito for lunch today. The waitress told me they caught you wanking into a bean burrito……again.
I love these threads. Every retard is a constitutional law scholar.
What Obama said in some interview is not relevant to whether it was a tax or a penalty. It is CONGRESSIONAL INTENT that is examined, as well as the actual text of the bill.
People who vote against their own interests are amusing to me. If they didn’t actually think they were unlucky millionaires who have hit a temporary patch of working-class it wouldn’t be as sad.
actually i wasn’t expecting it to pass
either was the white house. I think it caught many on the left by surprise. Truth is that we had planned to
attack the supreme court and get some traction.
Shit happens.
blabonis is actually correct. The individual planks of the bill are very very popular…getting
as high was 80% approval for their implementation. Its just obama needs to sell
the program better..
by november people will have “health care” fatigue which the polls are already
showing and we’ll be back to taling about bullshit.
smartman and the lady
2 peas in a pod!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOT…JUST MORE PHONY BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I got punked but i caught on fast…but not fast enough!
I love it when Harley says Justice Roberts saw the polls and the movement. Since when is the Supreme Court supposed to rule on a case based on polls!? You are supposed to be a college graduate. Did you ever take a civics class along the way? The court is supposed to rule based on the CONSTITUTION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is not supposed to be a popularity contest.
Speaking to Glazer’s point trying to discredit Romney as a candidate for being rich, I have no problem with it. If a candidate is not rich, he or she is even more beholding to donors and is more likely to be in their back pockets. Ever heard of George Soros? Unless something is changed, you either have to be rich to run or owe people who are rich. I’m not sure that being rich is not the lesser of those two evils.
mike….did you read
past cases….do you believe that personal and business ties don’t affect a justices vote. How ab out clarence
thomasas wife and her connections to anti health care lobbyists. Or justices speaking for money
at right wing conventions. Its a fucking popularity contest…and thats why the repub and cons are all
upset…they though they had roberts in the bag.
Get out and get involved…it is all politics….remember they’re appointed by political leaders….
rule based on the constitution…i can cite cases where that was not the case.
Sorry mike…
thanks. take care
reading glazer and harley on politics
Is like attending an acting class given by lindsey lohan and Adam sandler. You two clowns are in over your heads like 2 little people in the deep end of the pool. Two monkeys trying to fuck a football.
The passage of Obama care just woke up the 60 to 70 percent of people who oppose it. One and done for berry o.
No one mentions who’s at the public trough
and with such learned scholars pontificating, I would think that would have been noted.
I have 10 close Doctor friends. They can tell you who feeds at the trough daily? It
i’m predicting good days ahead
as the eternam optimist i believe things are going to be okay.
I watched fox news yesterday (yes..i actually watched it)…and they had a
panel of 12 doctors …some private practice..some hosptials…
being on fox i expected it to be far right anti aca…anti obama…
great lineup of doctors from the top practices and hopsilital.
I expected the worst…all against obama…but just like the
court ruling…
here were 12 doctors…11 of them siging the praise of the new
program…they had a few things that they said needed to be
ironed out…but almost all were in favor of obamacare on
fox news…i nearly fainted…
and smartman and wilson…keep your guns in your closets..
everthing will be oaky…..just some rought patches…
we did not expect to win the ruling..big surprise…but when people
hear the individual components of aca..some already affecting
10 million people…they like it.
As far as the tax…its only on those who don’t buy insurance. Look
at massachusettes…only 40,000 people are paying the tax/penalty.
that way we have no freeloaders hitting the system…its working
in massachusettes…it will work other places…
i think this nation has a great period ….its just the politicians
have to stop with all this cash…its going to destroy this
nation..on both sides.
@paul
What I don’t understand is why the people that employ all of these undocumented workers are not getting the crap fined out of them or shut down. Also with all of these injuries taking place, where is OSHA? You ran a business. To hire anyone anymore, there is a pile of paperwork required for the government to stay off your back, yet they let these construction companies operate in front of everybody in broad daylight with illegal workers and no safety procedures. These jobs are not jobs “Americans won’t do” either. They are good relatively high paying jobs when done by legal workers. All of these unemployed American contruction workers would be paying taxes if they were employed instead of these undocumented workers. This selective enforcement of laws is unacceptable!
who’s at the public trough
agribusiness….subsidies: 15 billion dollars
oil companies…subsidies 40 billion dollars
corporations: using loop holes in tax system to move assets/profits offshore…1 trillion dollars
in untaxed dollars
banks>…..jamie dimons bank got 12 billion dollars
pro sports….billions in tax breaks for locating in a city…
sprint…your buddies at amc….law firms…developers…billions of dollars
in tax breaks…
nbc/cbs/abc….billions in profits but pay no tax
tax cheats…taxavoiders….put the collection agencies after them…
theres hundred s of companies etc at hte public trough that are
taking from the system…
hopsitals…get tax breaks….
i could go on….and then theres the smaller pigs at the trough
mike…give us some examples
companies with undocumented workers…where are they…give us an example…
union contractors can hire them…g.c.’s can’t hire them on big jobs..
yea there may be some builders using this labor…but is it that big of
a problem?
Mike, here’s my view from where I sit
I can’t hire a single undocumented person. Not one. We rely on the E Verify system and others, a full 5 year FBI background check, etc. And, with my clients, they wouldn’t be allowed on site even if I could because of their own client based security requirements.
There are 100 ways around it. Some firms ask for proper ID and accept what ever you give them. I can tell you this, from the IRS perspective because I’ve seen it more times than I can count; you can send in improper ID, within 3-6 months you get a notice from the Feds saying, from their records, they dont think the SS is proper and they ask you to please verify it. If you dont, you never hear another word.
Landscape firms, contractors, they all have loops holes. A big one is to hire the preson, legitimately, through a temp service. They temp service provides you documentation that says everyone is legal and covered by the agency. You can hire them all day long, then, as you are paying the temp service. You right off the labor expense to the temp services, it becomes part of your GS&A, they aren’t on YOUR payroll.
Its endless, but 90% of the ones who claim to be documented, aren’t. And youre right, the income level is moving up all the time. I recent Western Union survey showes the Olathe Price Chopper as one of the Top 10 locations sending money to Mexico. Billions pour in there yearly, nothing comes back but the expense load we carry on their behalf.
wilson..funny you should bring that up
met a laddy last week who came from vegas who opened a labor employment service
in roeland park. she said she gets companies who won’t hire full time workers..and hires
temps so they don’t have to pay benefits etc.
its killing us…these epople get no benefits yet they are working 40 hours
as a ind contractor and when they get med problems they go to
emergency room.
the doctors on the fox show say that there are fewer emergency rooms but the
real problems in hospital (one of many) was the downturn in elective
surgeries.
okay…you and smartman see all these problems..
what the fuck do we do…something realistic that can be done right now.
I don’t wnt to hear about guns and other stuff…what do you (or your hero
willard) have planned to solve the problem.
its as if there’s no real answer.
If we don’t chage the health care system we go bankrupt…theres been
no laws about health care in u.s….its just been going along.
the doctors all said that they were to blame for their own problems
because they never did anything.
what the fuck do we do? someone has to step forward with an answer.
is aca the best answer….theres been nothing from romney except repeal
ande replace..
and what do you do with the 10 million kids…the 12 million people who
have already seen some real advnatges from aca? if you want to
bitch about the problem…give some solutions.
@mike, wilson
The easier question is who isn’t at the government hog trough? Corporate welfare is a bigger hog than people. The big money in welfare for the common folk is pennies on the dollar. The real blood sucking is done by social services (at one time the majority of welfare fraud was committed by case workers who knew the resources were not there to investigate).
ACA is a boon for the insurance industry and a disaster for the poor. But it is a start and perhaps folks will do the real reform necessary.
The Red States decry the government but they receive more dollars back than they pay in to the system.
And if you want to find who is hiring the illegals, look no farther than Walmart, Tyson, Smithfield, Premium Farms to start. They all hire through employment agencies so they can claim, we didn’t know.
I used to raise livestock in an area with lots of Mennonites and Amish. They never paid into social security, no insurance (they paid cash for medical) but when a catastrophic illness struck, they were on Medicaid.
Those celebrating a victory should rethink that position. More like we got a hit and now it is two-outs and a full count on the batter in the bottom of the ninth.
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/medical_examiner/2012/06/obamacare_and_medicaid_how_the_supreme_court_s_ruling_will_make_it_harder_to_extend_health_insurance_to_the_poor_.html
Wilson, let’s bet on the November election. If Mitt wins, I’ll smoke a seegar with you. If Obama wins, you’ll serve Mad Dog 20/20 at a party.
Halry, or whoever you are….
First, Im not a Willard/Romney fan. Not even a little bit, so don’t let what others say taint your opinion of who I am or what I think. Last time I checked, Im the only one who knows those answers.
What we should have done was stop the flood of illegals into this Country back when the problem began, or (2), had a fast track program for those who want to come for the right reasons, to get them papered and on their way. That plan should also screen out the human litter Mexico wants to unload on us, and send them back. The paper process should also come with a probation period. Olathe has a 14% illegal population and they are in excess of 60% of the crime. That should have a valve on the problem, if you offend, you go back home if its a high level misdemeaner or any felony.
But we’re too late for that. So all I can see is you raid the high saturation jobs who hire through temp firms. They are just as illegal if they are “cleared” by the temp agency or not. Problem is, ICE doenst want to mess with it. Its one of our largest Catch 22’s.
And yes, Orphan, you are correct as well, there are so many piglettes at the collective teets its hard to get in for a snack, let alone a meal. The voters can clean up both problems, I just dont have much faith left for where we are headed.
We are corrupt and content
Money for nothing and MTV
Republicans want cheap labor, Democrats want future voters. They are so cynical in their posturing.
As H L Mencken said, there are times when even the most decent man wants to raise the black flag and begin slitting throats.
where do you get the 14%
14% of olathes population is illegal? nev er knew that…knew they had large population of hispanics.
come on wilson you know who i am!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
it ain’t conservative, angry (old) white men (outside of barren, meaningless states with few electoral votes.)- we’re dying off. As the Staples Family said: “Take the sheet off your face, boy, it’s a brand new day.”……..no matter how many over-priced tee shirts Glen Beck sells. The sleeping giants are women and Hispanics, and Conservatives have made it very clear what they think of those groups. Losing power is a bitch, especially after 500 years of white dick rule, I get it. I just wish we could go out with a little more dignity. All this whining and false posturing is embarrassing.
The user name said “HALRY”
I assumed it was another stupid fuck imitating you. I figured you could at least spell your own user name correctly.
The figure came from two OPD officers and a friend at City Hall who, you might say,
rkcal is 100% right
i’ve been saying that the hispanic vote decides the wnner…now with aca health care passed..and
the immigration order it looks like obama get 70-75% of the hispanic vote…and should get
a huge increase in the female vote. Thats the game….arizona is in play….florida should
get in obamas column…along with ohio and michigan (obama has big leads there)..
if thats the way…its over.
and over for the long term for any republican as prez…numbers for the minority vote
is growing dramatically while as rkcal says its lights out for the white rule in america.
i said it 2 years ago…the demos are changing…get ready…it is coming.
Lincoln said it best
A house divided against itself cannot stand. That is where we are today as a country. More divided now than ever before along political, racial and ideological lines. No diplomacy or compromise is going to resolve this. So let’s just cut to the chase and duke it out in the streets and to the victor go the spoils. What is so hard about that? If you’re not willing to sacrifice and die for what you believe in what the fuck good are you? We’ve turned into a nation of pussies, none bigger than Pelosi, Reid, Obama and Boehner.
I’ve had an incredible life. Probably better than 90% of the people who walked on the face of this earth before me. Many of whom selflessly and willingly made sacrifices to make the world a better place for their families and fellow man, and not necessarily themselves. I’m sick of cunts like Joy Behar and Rachel Maddow and swells like Bob Beckel and Dick Morris telling me how it is. OFF WITH THEIR HEADS!
The least we can do as Americans is recognize that we have fucked up a pretty good thing vis a vis new age liberalism and social justice, correct those errors through a massive bloodletting and put the train of liberty and true democracy back on the track pointed in the right direction.
this begs another question
Why aren’t the temp services held accountable to labor laws if they are the direct employers?
By the way Harley, in west Olathe down along Parker Ave.,about 1/2 of the people you run into barely speak English. That is where the people Paul is referring to are at.
Welp we gave it all away and this is what we are now going to get because of it.
We are now to the point as we was back in grade school in the 60’s where you was trained for a tornado/nuke event that you just needed to sit down raise your knees drop your head between them and kiss your ass good-bye.
To late now folks and Smartman is right much blood will be spilled before it gets better then if any are left it’s back to the drawing board sans the pussy tree huggers.
Harley you liberal pussy
I only hope you get to truly experience the multicultral diversity that you want us all to accept while you stay safe in joco. You and your ilk will be the first victims when the shtf.
@mike w/aside to smartman
Walmart’s labor supplier has busted a year or so back. When they raided the factory farms in Iowa the took the temp agencies employment files. But it’s a pyramid scheme of dirty jobs and there aren’t enough investigators. The laws have been strengthened and they are now not only going after the agencies but also the employers.
Walmart is involved with their agency in conspiring to provide illegals for work. Or at least that is a charge brought against them. After the revelations in Mexico, well we can all jump to our own conclusions.
I always wanted to go out like Ambrose Bierce. Strap on my pistolas, climb in the saddle and go off to fight the corrupt government. Or end up as scat from a bear or puma.
No Surprises Here
When cross-eyed “Hope and Change-ful” libs elect an unqualified, unskilled, unvetted, unknown, socialist/commie-leaning, bullshit artist.
Now we get the full blast effect from his two new circus clowns in the SCOTUS who will never vote against their saviour. An avowed racist and charter member of LaRaza, and a diesel dyke softball coach, who both rabidly hate the contstitution.
Yes, boys, the phone is ringing and this is the wakeup call. Do you hear it?
The variable are way outta my purview, extrapolation
of those same variables escapes me.
I have read experts from both sides of the issue claim prima facie evidence of arguments that are supposed to light the way for morons like me, and, well, who the fuck knows.
My guess is, that the folks paying taxes in this country, just got dunned again to pay for foks who collect the govt cheese.
A simplistic take, but the track record for federal interference in the economy is pretty clear.
Pauls takes seem accurate and local, leaving us somehthing to really get our teeth into. The acnecdotal nature of those same takes add credibility and immediacy in my opinion.
I am in Boulder Co. this weekend and found myself drinking beer in a bar. Go figure. There are nothing but shite folks here, and they think Obama is god. They also stop and contribute on every street corner to Gren Peace guys wanting money for Orangutangs and Tigers. I am not kidding. Serious conversations, then the exchange of the coin of the realm, with a knowing nod and a glance that says, We Are Heroes. Ok. I like animals.
I hope these fuckers in Boulder like them too, when the time comes to live next door to them, and hand over the rest of their cash.
This postcard from teh edge is brought to you by a European, Judeo/Christian ethos infected white boy who thinks he wants to car pool with smartman to The Bullet Hole.
shite folks-that was an accident-providence?
white folks take another hit.
@wilsun
I am nott a stoopid fuk imitaiting harley……………………….
hee is imuttateing me…………………………….
0nce a deuche bag
always a deuche bag harly1
trisch
rong u r………………
im nott a doosh bagg……………………
awl the wgae slave jusers on hear r……………………
eye figgered owt hoo u r trisch……………..
u r wilsun……………..
eye kan proov it……………..
hardly is alwayse wright…………..
PUNKED AGGAIN……………………
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha……………………………………………………..