OTC: Mizzou & NU Pursue Big 10 / Shanin & Parks Go Dark (for 10 minutes)
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Sections
Brencado
Tom Keegan? Who the hell is that D-bag. Oh, he works for the antiquated newspaper industry. I guess he’ll be writing copy in the Pennysaver in a few months or penning Don Fambrough’s soon to be published obituary.
barry
kmbz has a habit of weird broadcasting miscues. anyone remember the time they ran commercials straight through an entire half inning of a royals’ broadcast? listening to the broadcast on headphones this season in the stadium is generally pot luck. sometimes the announcers are in sync with the play on the field, sometimes they are delayed by two seconds or so, and some times they are seven seconds behind the action. as best as i can tell, they make their engineer put on a blindfold and guess which buttons to push.
KU
Getting the KU side of the story from Keitzman’s lapdog Clinkscales is like getting US history from a Soviet textbook.
That white trash, self-loathing hack doesn’t have a kind word to say about his alma mater unless his lord and master Kevin feeds him one.
dp
Hilarious about Jack Harry’s plug for the pinball feature. I honestly can’t think of anything I’d rather watch less than a Mad Jack Pinball feature…
MrOlathe
Ditto on Clinks. And Keegan is no KU homer. He’s been in town for a couple of years. The Lawrence Journal World takes as much glee in bad news at KU as KK. Maybe Clinks could get a job there?
smartman
That was the best 10 minutes of Shanin and Parks EVER! Those idiots make Wayne’s World look like Firing Line.
I’m amazed that Notre Dame alums, and I know quite a few, still think the school relevant in sports. It’s based in emotion more than fact and you know how hard it is to reason with people that make emotional decisions…right Obama voters?
Where there is money and power there is GREED and CORRUPTION. I’m sure very few NCAA D1 schools are squeaky clean in their athletic programs.
If NU and MU bolt to the Big 10 it will have a negative impact on recruiting for football at KU and KSU. Kiss those programs goodbye.
Cliffy
If Nebraska gets into the Big 10, are they finally going to try to do something about their dreadful basketball program? I guess Northwestern would like it since there would now be somebody for them to beat.
It will be interesting to see how slick Lew wriggles his way out of this one. Screw KK and Clunk but I hope both of them are right.
Jon
“GH: …Missouri is a much bigger fish for the Big 10 over the next 20 years than Nebraska.”
What, exactly, has Missouri done in any sport lately (or ever, for that matter) to warrant such blind optimism?
Some words of advice for you Greg…
PUT DOWN THE CRACK PIPE.
___
GH: It’s what MU brings to the Big 10 party in terms of population, televisions and their ability to recruit high-caliber athletes in both football and basketball. Nebraska has an intense, rabid fan base but their numbers nationally are nowhere near numerous enough to weather a downturn in football similar to what ND has suffered but survived.
Ptolemy
I don’t hate Lew “Simon bar Sinister” Perkins. I just enjoy pointing-and-laughing when KU people have to defend him.
I missed the KMBZ screw-up because I turned the dial to 810. Who gives a flying leap about hearing the police chief yap about the arrest of another minorority? That’s unlistenable radio, so dead-air was more entertaining and informing.
Plus, dead air or a presser by an inconsequential police executive is no opportunity for me to IM the most thin-skinned radio hosts in KC.
Ptolemy
By the way, I find it amusingly ironic and telling that the two schools talking most about leaving the Big 12 are the two out of the conference that have the most inaccurately inflated view of themselves and their programs.
jojo
Why is mu much more attractive to the big
10 than nebraska. 2 of the top 30 tv markets.
More money coming in than at texas. More
alumni cash than many other big 10 schools
and ivy league.
Alumni at key media positions throughout the
tv/radio and sports broadcast networks.
A sports program that continues to grow..
and is on the verge of being a top 10
football and top 25 basektball program.
Money and exposure.
Forget about Nebraska and their alumni across
the nation. Thats pure b.s. Thats old days.
Nebraska has trouble drawing numbers when they
are on national tv and there are no big tv
markets in that state that makes them attractive.
The big 10 needs teams…with their tv channels
they can draw viewers and advertisers.
Nebraska adds a little extra to their league but
really is just afiller to atrract midwest
viewers.
If you notice…west coast football is down
in ratings and quality.
East coast football is down. SEC is huge but
those teams aren’t going anywhere with the
money they are now getting.
So the big 10 raids MU from the big 12…the
big 12 falls apart…they cut deal with
NU because nebraska can’t just sit around waiting
for someone to call them to play in a conference.
The texas schools and ok. parlay a separate league and add some southwest schools hoping to
cut a deal that brings them money.
Ok and texas are not hat dependent on tv money..
they have millions coming in. Ok state is set…
and they have a 10 team legue and they are
national contenders every year for visibility.
Don’t hold your breath nebraska fans. The
big 10 doesnt need you. You’ll have to cut a
deal when you go begging to get into the
big time or just stay with the little 11
schools and still get exposure.
Its money guys…lots of it…and missouri is
starting to become a huge money making machine.
Sports isn’t the only factor. The big 10 wants
academic schools with lots of cash (and the
wal mart familiy has it) to spend to upgrade
the schools to be the #1 academic league.
Nebraska is hardly known for its acadmic status
graduating players who can’t even read.
KU is even worse.
ALSO…I WARNED YOU ABOUT LOU. AS A MU ALUMNI I
HAVE SEEN WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU HAVE LYING
CHEATING DIRECTERS RUNNING THE DEPARTMENTS…
YOU SLEEP WITH A DOG..YOU GET FLEAS…
Herbie
If Nebraska is more IHOP than Ruth Chris’, then why has Missouri been forced to play Waffle House bowl games the past two years?
Cliffy
Herbie … you just don’t get it. It’s not all about athletics and it’s certainly not only about football, which is the only thing Nebraska has going for it. It’s about money. Missouri has 5 or 6 times more people in it than Nebraska. Sorry, but you can’t change that. Nebraska just might be able to get into the B10 on its football reputation, and if that happens, good for them. But Missouri is still by far the superior choice.
MrOlathe
Will MU fans be happy or unhappy if Lew works his way into the Big 10? They just might take MU, NU, & KU.
jojo
would love to have ku in the big 10 with
us/mu. That assures us kicking the jayhawks
ass in football for the next 20 years and getting
a close up seat when the hawks choke in ncaa
turney…(lol)….just joking hawk fans.
Saw one of
the assistant ku jayhawk coaches…whata joke…
he made more idiotic comments than anyone I’ve
jheard before…..can’t wait til arrowhead
in nvoember……
Herbie
Jojo–you need to do us all a favor and go play in traffic.
“2 of the top 30 tv markets.”
Great if you make your money via subscriber rates. Big 10 Network makes the bulk of its cash via advertising. You need teams that get ratings to sell advertising, and Mizzery doesn’t get ratings.
“More money coming in than at texas.”
Not according to the reports that came out yesterday. Regardless, it doesn’t look good if you have that much cash and have done jack and squat with it as Mizzery has.
“Alumni at key media positions throughout the
tv/radio and sports broadcast networks.”
That has nothing to do with why the Big 10 would select Mizzery, and everything to do with why there are so many douchebag sports media personalities.
“on the verge of being a top 10
football and top 25 basektball program.”
Um, no on the first one (not even close, really), and maybe in the next decade for basketball. Problem is, the Big 10 wants to make money now, not in 10 years.
“Forget about Nebraska and their alumni across
the nation. Thats pure b.s. Thats old days.
Nebraska has trouble drawing numbers when they
are on national tv and there are no big tv
markets in that state that makes them attractive.”
Wow, they grow ’em stupid in Columbia, don’t they? Mizzery averaged a 2.04 share last year; Nebraska a 3.57 share. The ONLY Big 10 expansion candidate (including the ‘Domers) that comes close is Pitt with 3.31 last season. That’s decidedly more viewers than the entire population of Nebraska, which also shows that there are alumni outside of Nebraska that watch. Plus, go to any mall in KC, St. Louis, or Denver, and you’ll find Nebraska paraphernalia being sold, as those markets also support Nebraska.
“The big 10 needs teams
nick
Greg,
Assuming Lew Perkins comes out of the ticket scandal clean (it’s my opinion Kietzman WANTS Sweet Lew out at Kansas ’cause KK knows that Lew’s ruthless style has benefitted Kansas’ athletics greatly), don’t you think Perkins will figure out a way to make sure Kansas doesn’t get screwed?
In fact, if Kansas State is truly tied to KU’s hip per state law, Kietzman and K-State should WANT Perkins to stay at Kansas, ’cause Perkins may figure out a way to keep both schools in relevant conferences should MU, Nebraska, Texas, A&M and Colorado all eventually bolt.
___
GH: Lew is KU’s best hope to survive Conference Gate
Ptolemy
Mizzou and the Huskers trying to fluff themselves for the Big 10 looks like Ellen Degeneres trying to photoshop her head onto Denise Milani’s body.
Gavin
As a KU fan (homer), I will cop to being nervous as hell about this. It’s not just jealousy about the possibility of losing “ground” to Missouri, although that’s part of it. I also think that Mizzou leaving weakens the KU-MU rivalry and I’d hate to see that. There are a lot of non-conference rivalries that are doing well despite the fact that their games don’t “mean” anything beyond the rivalry, but I really think that longtime rivals leaving a shared conference affiliation would, in addition to never being done before, take away some of what makes the rivalry so good.
But more than those things is the possibility of KU becoming a minor player. Without a power conference affiliation, it would be tough for KU to remain relevant. I know, I know, there are plenty of jokes to be made by MU and K-State fans suggesting that KU isn’t relevant, never was relevant, etc. Go ahead.
Anyway, the reason I think it will work out alright is because Lew Perkins is a vicious and cunning man. And I say that with all the respect and admiration I can muster. Obviously, if Lew was involved in the ticket scandal, that’s a game changer but if he is cleared I think Lew will find a place for KU. It may be in finagling an invitation from the Big Ten, it may be in helping to engineer some sort of merger/partnership with the Pac-10 (which is a hot topic right now), and it may be in some other way no one else knows about. But I suspect that Lew is already working every angle he possibly can to make sure KU has a soft landing when all is said and done. The question I have is this: If Lew manages to get a parachute for KU and it involves KU leaving the Big XII, will the state of Kansas go along with it or will they do like the state of Texas did with Baylor and the state of Virginia did with Va. Tech and tell KU they can’t go unless K-State comes with them?
Also, I have a question about TV markets. I get that Missouri is a more populous state than both Nebraska and Kansas. I tend to side with Greg’s view of what Nebraska brings to the table, but if you’re looking at KU, doesn’t KU bring about as many TV sets in Kansas City as Mizzou? I’m not taking a shot at Mizzou here, really. But it seems to me that Mizzou is no more valuable in the Kansas City market than KU. The real power Mizzou brings is from St. Louis, right? But doesn’t the Big Ten already “claim” St. Louis as part of its footprint?
can’t say
Is jojo now calling himself Herbie?
Greg here is the problem with the ESPN coverage of the lacrosse players death. They COMPLETELY ignored the first Big Ben allegation because they said it wasn’t news. But now they think a college kids death is news. So they play fast and easy with the rules of reporting. Not cool.
___
GH: What is happening in sports journalism is that the rules are changing as fast as the stories. ESPN erred when they initially refused to cover BB
nick
There’s a couple inferences on replies to Greg’s post that MU is by far the better football school than Kansas. I don’t really understand that. Yes, Missouri seems to be have a little better athletes and appear ahead of Kansas based on KU’s horrendous 2009 season.
But in the last 10 years, head-to-head, the school’s are 5-5. Add up all the points in those games and MU is +2 points.
In those 10 years, the bowls and records:
MU: 6 bowls (no BCS bowls), 3-3 record.
KU: 4 bowls (including BCS Orange), 3-1 record.
I feel like some Missouri fans live in a some Bizarro World. Your program is solid and steady. Nothing more. Mangino made KU’s program nearly equally solid. And based on Pinkel failing to get his recent teams to higher finishes with elite-talented teams, I predict Pinkel has peaked. They ain’t EVER doing better under Pinkel.
I won’t predict Turner Gill to do better than Pinkel…too early too say. But it won’t surprise me if Gill coaches in a BCS bowl some day. Pinkel never will.
Cliffy
I see what you’re saying Gavin, but the B10 can’t truly claim St. Louis as part of their footprint based on Illinois. And yes, you’re right, KU could deliver as many or more TV sets in KC as MU. But it’s just KC.
And thanks for at least admitting MU’s departure from the B10 concerns you. KU fans have a little trouble admitting that. I would be fine with both schools making the jump to the B10 but I just don’t see it happening.
I wish this region had enough people, money and power to have sustained the old Big 8 … but I may as well be wishing for a return to $1.00 a gallon gasoline.
dp
I have heard that the KS Board of Regents won’t split K-State and KU up, meaning they won’t approve a move of one school without the other. A fellow K-State fan told me this so I’m taking it with a grain of salt. Has anybody else heard of this?
Also, Jojo, that’s an early front-runner for worst, most uniformed post of the year for all the points Herbie points out. I’ve been hearing MU is ‘on the verge’ in football for about a decade. Go 5-1 against the South the next two years and win a bowl game or two against a real team and I might start to believe. MU fans forget the last time they took the field they were totally outclassed and dominated by a service academy in a three TD loss. Oh, and that was with a first round NFL LB too they won’t have this year.
Oh, oh, but we got Gabbert. I haven’t seen this much hype since Chase ‘I didn’t beat anyone I wasn’t supposed to Daniel’ and pee’d my pants against all BXII South teams. Yawn.
Cliffy
What would Greg do without jojo to stir things up? I really get a kick out of you guys thinking you can shut him up. Hilarious.
Cliffy
DP says, “Oh, oh, but we got Gabbert. I haven
Gavin
Cliffy, I think any KU fan who denies some level of concern has to be lying. Again, I think (hope) everything will work out for KU, but it’s just hard to see.
As for all the talk of how the Kansas Legislature would handle this, I guess it’s now clear who is the big brother in the KU/K-State family. K-State can’t make it alone and needs a protector.
The Independent Rage
Maybe Nick Wright can combine elements of Whitlock’s new political column and Pay Dirt’s radio show and start a 6:00 p.m. Wednesday night political talk show on 610. He could call it, “What’s Wrong With This Country”.
Dexter Morgan
GH: What is happening in sports journalism is that the rules are changing as fast as the stories.
I really believe we are witnessing an exponential evolution of how news is reported and digested in the USA. We thought things changed after Watergate? Tigergate
Cliffy
While Mizzou and Nebraska “fluff themselves,” KSU is the ugly girl at the party sitting alone waiting for somebody to ask her to dance.
Hammy
nick, when was the last time ku finished ahead of Mizzou in the conference football standings? I honestly can’t remember.
Greg,
I agree with your take, Nebraska’s appeal lies with their on field success. If they have a rough patch they are really hurt. Missouri’s appeal has something to do with success but way more to do with population, which isn’t as fleeting as success. Thats what so many people don’t get, they act like the Big Ten wants to add a great team. They want to add revenue.
nick
Hammy,
Been longer than 10 years since KU finished ahead of Missouri. They both were 7-1 in 2007.
My point is, I keep hearing from Missouri fans how they are now a football school with a legit, year-after-year contender. Maybe so. But it’s looking to me like Pinkel may have peaked. Are Missouri fans OK with 4-6 wins every year? Pinkel looks to be a bowl coach every year, but I seriously doubt he has what it takes to win the league, or to even win the North again.
Snyder’s gonna keep K-State solid. Lew Perkins and Turner Gill, with new, highly-touted coordinators look a likely bet to get KU fighting for a North title in a few years.
In my opinion, Pinkel’s peak was 2007. But his high-quality team BLEW IT by losing twice to Oklahoma. The Sooners were very good, but beatable…proving that in a loss to Colorado, a squeaker over ISU and a 20-point Championship Bowl loss.
In 2008, another very good MU team blew their season by losing a home game to OSU. Then, of course, KU beat MU in the Arrowhead thriller.
Stevo
JOJO:
I didn’t even read 5 lines of your post so I’ll just apply to the thing I saw early on…
“more money than Texas”
No way no how. You’re thinking about cities. If it’s Texas think about cities, or states. Mizzou adds K.C. and the part of St. Louis that isn’t already tuned in from Illinois. Texas would add Dallas, #5 Market, Austin, Houstin and the rest of the 2nd most populated state in the country! MU bring in more money than Texas? Ha that is laughable.
Kent
Cliffy: You’re right that it’s about more than athletics and more than football. You’re wrong that football is the only thing that Nebraska has going for it. NU is 6th in the Director’s Cup standings. Mizzou? 42nd. Looking strictly at athletics, Nebraska is a more well-rounded, attractive choice for the Big 10 than Mizzou. Of course, they’re not just looking at athletics, and the two decent sized markets in Missouri makes it pretty attractive to conferences.
Stevo
Greg don’t forget “Friday Night Lights” comes back tonight. You get to cry like a teenage girl again!
___
GH: Can’t wait to catch up w/ Landry, Coach, Riggins, Saracen and all those well-built Texas women. “Clear eyes, full hearts, can’t lose!”
kctacomonday
I like eating sandwiches.
Hammy
peeked in 07? When they were ranked #1? You never know. But I would hardly classify this as a 4-6 win team going forward. Last year was a complete rebuilding year and the team still went to a bowl. Look at the recruits coming into Columbia and tell me you don’t see a marked improvement.
DonkeyPunch
good lord. I had no idea the comments on Greg’s columns turned into mini-essays.
K.I.S.S
Keep It Simple Stupid
Cliffy
Herbie snapped, DonkeyPunch. It’s JoJo’s fault.
jojo ?
I’ve always wanted to go dark for ten minutes.
Can’t Say
Remember no TMZ slams allowed. That’s where the girl works.
Greg great take on ESPN and their journalism and moving target integrity. I’m curious Greg. Do you think things have changed so much where if say….A Chiefs head coach was having an affair with his running back’s girlfriend would that now be covered or no KC is to small market?
And the bottom line as far as press coverage. If you want to look for breaking stories. Like Tiger. Like Edwards love child. You aren’t going to find it in the Washington Post or New York Times. It’s the Enquirer or the internet. Maybe that’s another reason paper’s are dying. The Tiger story was out their for ages before anyone hooked onto it.
___
GH: Yes, Marty would be Tigerized in today
Cliffy
Not what I meant, Kent. Everybody knows Nebraska has a good overall athletic program, but only two sports matter. Football and basketball. While football is far more important than basketball, Nebraska has arguably the worst basketball program in the B12.
Kent
And how many national championships have the Tigers won in those two sports that matter? Again, strictly from the viewpoint of athletic success, Nebraska is certainly no less attractive than Mizzou (and I would argue considerably more attractive).
One other significant fact … for all the talk of Missouri’s huge population advantage over Nebraska and the lucrative television markets, it says something that NU’s athletic budget is more than 50 percent higher than MU’s, and second only to Texas in the Big 12. That money is coming from somewhere, and I would think that would speak to the AD’s in the Big 10.
MoCrash
The Big 10 covets the St. Louis TV market as among the strongest that it could add to its regional line-up, so Missouri offers something Nebraska may not. That the Tigers can field teams which are competitive to the Big 10 in both of the major revenue-producing sports is also helpful. There’s no question the better value is Missouri; it has nothing to do with national championships (in case anybody remains under the delusion that College Football has anything to do with college or football).
I hate to see it because of the great traditions and rivalries in the Big 12. I didn’t want to add the SWC teams, either. However, it is an economic necessity to maximize revenue because of the negative impact football and men’s basketball have on the overall university budget (let nobody tell you schools “make” money on football; they don’t, they just try to avoid losing as much and are capable of accounting maneuvers to make it appear profitable).
Stevo
Correction:
KSU is the the drunk girl sitting alone at the party pretending she is passed out so someone will feel her up.
Okay…blah, blah if you want to read the best analysis out there check this out. This is an Illinois guy and his analysis is extremely thorough and unbiased from our perspective.
http://frankthetank.wordpress.com/2010/04/25/getting-krunk-on-expansion-news-or-lack-thereof/
Don’t be a jackass and pass it over if because of the guy’s blog name. He’ll tell you why you’re an idiot if you think the Big 10 is taking Kansas, and why Missouri is a “safe, but not bold” pick. Read it objectively without your team’s interests as your priority and it will open your eyes a bit. Check out the link in the story to his original Big 10 Expansion Index that’s several months old. Tellin ya it’s good stuff.
smartman
NU gets shitpiles of money from Warren Buffet and Dan.. Larry The Cable Guy.. Whitney. In my opinion Nebraska is still too cornpone for the wanna be WASP’s in the BIG TEN. MU, Pitt and Rutgers have less inbreeding in the bloodlines. However this shakes out KU and KSU are gonna get hung out like Dale Jr going high at Talladegha. Those two programs stand to lose the most by any realignment which will also be a sack draining experience for the metro area. We are doomed to sloppy seconds in college and pro sports. We are a drinking town with a sports problem.
Stevo
At least the Big 12 has started talking to the Pac 10 for contingencies. If it goes to a huge B10 and a huge SEC, those schools are going to be empowered and so is there conference. But that isn’t going to make Northwestern, Indiana, Kentucky or Purdue power football programs. Big 12 and Pac 10 negotiating together could probably get each school a decent bump in money and they could bring in a number of schools that are better than 3 or 4 of the B10’s members in terms of football: BYU, Boise State, Utah, TCU. Throw Memphis into the B12 for basketball. There’s no scenario the new B12 would make as much money as the B10 or SEC but they could still be just as competitive. B10 football has been sliding for years anyway. Look at their recruiting rankings. Kids don’t want to go North to play football outdoors anymore. Boise State and BYU have been beating a lot of majors every year already. The arms race will continue but KU anyway is in okay shape because their NC allowed them to upgrade bball big time to top notch facilities. We’ll see what Turner can get the coughers to cough up when he wins…or not. I think KU-KSU will be fine unless the B12 is completely picked apart, losing the Oklahoma schools to the SEC, too. In that case when the st. of ks would be losing both BCS affiliations I think they’d let KU go to a BCS conference if they could find one w/o KSU if that conference wouldn’t take the Cats. PAC 10 or ACC might take them for basketball
Rainbow Man
Nebraska may have few TV sets but EVERY set will be watching. I would hardly characterize NU’s status as “precarious and fragile.” They are a very solid athletic dept. This would be a huge pickup for the Big Ten. Bigger than MU for sure.
Who would you rather watch.. Ohio State/ Nebraska or MU? KK wants this to happen because K State loses an automatic loss every year.
Omaha is emerging as a very serious market. The Big 10 would love it.
MoCrash
Sorry, Rainbow Man, it has nothing to do with who had more attractive football programs; it’s expanding market size (ratings irrespective). Omaha is not close to St. Louis, and with Missouri you also add a split Kansas City. If the Big 10 could get Nebraska along with Missouri, that would work fine, but the preference is towards Mizzou because it brings more sets and thus higher rates for the TV package. Follow the money, friend.
Rainbow Man
If the Big Ten could just add, MU, Nebraska, Notre Dame, Rutgers, and Pitt… Killer Conference!!
MoCrash you are right… MU does bring a better market and it has a great academic standard. I am not saying MU is not a good Big Ten fit… because it is. I want both to join the Big Ten.
The Big Ten is a “Cold Weather” conference. MU and NU can handle it.. I seriously doubt Texas will play half of their games in that.
jojo
SO LONG SUCKERS! WE’RE OUTTA HERE! TAke
YOUR HAWK AND CAT STICKERS AND SHOVE THEM
UP YOUR A$$. YOU’LL END UP PLAYING UTEP OR
TULSA…..WE’RE GONE TO THE BIG TIME.
SO LONG HAWKS….WISH YA LUCK WITH UNCLE
TOM TURNER.
SO LONG CATS…GOOD LUCK WITH SNYDER BEFORE
HE KEELSVOVER…AND MARTIN BEFORE HE WACKS ONE
OF HIS PLAYERS FOR FOULING OUT.
BYE BYE…I TOLD YOU SO.
ON TO GREENER PASTURES FOR THE MU TIGERS.
HAVE FUN WITH YOUR DIV 1 LEAGUE KU!
imchillen
KU fans don’t seem to be handling the fact the B10 is interested in MU and not them. This causes them to become extremely confused lashing out at KState for potentially holding them back based on unsubstantiated rumors. Get over yourselves and/or grow up.